Hill Cumorah CC wrote:

Don N wrote: If we are going to discuss the meaning of "Elohim" and theosis/deification, we ought to do it on another thread.

Yes sir.

Hey, it's just a thought. I have no power over this discussion board. It just seemed we'd drifted from the original question.

It's a good idea to take completely different topics into a new thread. It helps keep the discussions more organized. Obviously though we realize that discussing one topic inevitably leads to another.

You should sit in on some of the conversations I get into.

look up the definition and compare it to a members life and you will see that yes we are

I am not sure if this thread is still going because there haven't been any new comments in awhile.
BUT...
Many times I have heard this because of the fact that we do not believe in the Trinity which the NICEAN creed outlined.
The way I see it... I was baptised in the name of Christ, I was taught to believe in and love Christ, I believe him to be my Savior, Redeemer, etc... I LOVE him! To me.. there is no question... I AM a Christian! I may not believe in him as the Catolics, Baptisit, etc.. but the bottom line is that I DO believe in him, therefore I am HIS!

Jesus is God eternal. "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."

Joseph wrote:

jabo777 wrote:Define godhood then Joseph? Do you become a god of another planet/universe? From my understanding, a god is a god is god, right?

How can you become like God without being a god? In what way are you like God then?

Respectfully, this notion of becoming a god is the same mistake lucifer made. In Isaiah 14:12-14 says the following:

12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

13For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

14I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.

It is also the lie lucifer sold to Eve, that she would become like God.

I must disagree vehemently with this notion that we can become gods. In my estimation it is the most dangerous thing one can believe in. We must glorify God only. There is only one God, and there is no other.

simmmo wrote:Jesus is God eternal. "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."

I don't see how that verse even slightly proves that they are the same being. Besides, I find the idea of a god with multiple personality disorder rather insane. A being as perfect as God would not have such a defect.

simmmo wrote:Respectfully, this notion of becoming a god is the same mistake lucifer made. In Isaiah 14:12-14 says the following:

12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

13For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

14I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.

It is also the lie lucifer sold to Eve, that she would become like God.

I must disagree vehemently with this notion that we can become gods. In my estimation it is the most dangerous thing one can believe in. We must glorify God only. There is only one God, and there is no other.

Lucifer was power hungry and wanted to become better than God. Our religious philosophy is that we have the potential to become gods through perfecting ourselves. As is part of a poem I quite enjoy, "as man now is, God once was, as God now is, man may become". Its a much more logically appealing theology.

faazshift wrote:

simmmo wrote:Jesus is God eternal. "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."

I don't see how that verse even slightly proves that they are the same being. Besides, I find the idea of a god with multiple personality disorder rather insane. A being as perfect as God would not have such a defect.

simmmo wrote:Respectfully, this notion of becoming a god is the same mistake lucifer made. In Isaiah 14:12-14 says the following:

12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

13For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

14I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.

It is also the lie lucifer sold to Eve, that she would become like God.

I must disagree vehemently with this notion that we can become gods. In my estimation it is the most dangerous thing one can believe in. We must glorify God only. There is only one God, and there is no other.

Lucifer was power hungry and wanted to become better than God. Our religious philosophy is that we have the potential to become gods through perfecting ourselves. As is part of a poem I quite enjoy, "as man now is, God once was, as God now is, man may become". Its a much more logically appealing theology.

As i understand it the LDS church believes in a doctrine called exaltation - which is exactly the mistake lucifer made. we are not to exalt ourselves, but God only. Furthermore, there is no evidence in the Bible in favor of the propisition that God was once a man like us. I'm afraid that we'll have to agree to disagree on this.

Additionally, the Trinity doctrine does not imply some kind of personality disorder. The Father, Son and Holy Ghost are one in purpose and being. Furthermore, the quote from John conclusively makes clear that God and the Word (Jesus) are one in the same. It also makes clear that Jesus was not a created being but God Himself. It is the very reason that John chose to begin his gospel with such a statement.

simmmo wrote:As i understand it the LDS church believes in a doctrine called exaltation - which is exactly the mistake lucifer made. we are not to exalt ourselves, but God only. Furthermore, there is no evidence in the Bible in favor of the propisition that God was once a man like us. I'm afraid that we'll have to agree to disagree on this.

Additionally, the Trinity doctrine does not imply some kind of personality disorder. The Father, Son and Holy Ghost are one in purpose and being. Furthermore, the quote from John conclusively makes clear that God and the Word (Jesus) are one in the same. It also makes clear that Jesus was not a created being but God Himself. It is the very reason that John chose to begin his gospel with such a statement.

Exaltation is not something where we are power hungry. Exaltation is God's promised reward to us if we become worthy of it through our diligence.

One of my biggest problems with the idea of the trinity is that its a man-made idea. It was the result of a compromise made during the Nicene Creed. Nextly, we believe that God, Christ, and the Holy Ghost are one in purpose, not one in being. It makes more sense that they are distinctive beings, united in purpose. In fact, our church was begun as a result of Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ (separate individuals) appearing to Joseph Smith because of his fervent prayer.

faazshift wrote:

simmmo wrote:As i understand it the LDS church believes in a doctrine called exaltation - which is exactly the mistake lucifer made. we are not to exalt ourselves, but God only. Furthermore, there is no evidence in the Bible in favor of the propisition that God was once a man like us. I'm afraid that we'll have to agree to disagree on this.

Additionally, the Trinity doctrine does not imply some kind of personality disorder. The Father, Son and Holy Ghost are one in purpose and being. Furthermore, the quote from John conclusively makes clear that God and the Word (Jesus) are one in the same. It also makes clear that Jesus was not a created being but God Himself. It is the very reason that John chose to begin his gospel with such a statement.

Exaltation is not something where we are power hungry. Exaltation is God's promised reward to us if we become worthy of it through our diligence.

One of my biggest problems with the idea of the trinity is that its a man-made idea. It was the result of a compromise made during the Nicene Creed. Nextly, we believe that God, Christ, and the Holy Ghost are one in purpose, not one in being. It makes more sense that they are distinctive beings, united in purpose. In fact, our church was begun as a result of Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ (separate individuals) appearing to Joseph Smith because of his fervent prayer.

I think we'll have to agree to disagree on that one.

Simmo, you'll also need to agree that the teaching of "Trinity" is nowhere explicitly taught in the Bible (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trinity). That is the common consensus of Gospel scholars. The doctrine of Trinity, so central to traditional Christianity (indeed, the very argument used by many to call us non-christian), is not taught clearly in the Bible. That seems like a crucial ommission to me.

The word "Trinity" is not found in the Bible. But the Bible makes clear that Jesus is God, and that the Holy Spirit is God. Furthermore, the Bible states that there is only one God. The Father, Son and Holy Spirit are three in one

simmmo wrote:The word "Trinity" is not found in the Bible. But the Bible makes clear that Jesus is God, and that the Holy Spirit is God. Furthermore, the Bible states that there is only one God. The Father, Son and Holy Spirit are three in one

No you don't understand, it's not just about the word missing. Scholars agree that the Trinitarian doctrine is "not taught explicitly" in the Bible. It is not "clear", as you say it. John 17 is a perfect example of a scripture that makes Trinitarianism far from "clear", with the Son praying to the Father that his disciples may become one with him (Jesus) as he (Jesus) is one with the father.

It isn't clear, it is subject to interpretation, and that is exactly what the Trinity doctrine is: an interpretation of isolated New testament passages by a group of bishops, hundreds of years after the contemporary followers of Christ (who never heard of the Trinity) had all died.

nicolasconnault wrote:

simmmo wrote:The word "Trinity" is not found in the Bible. But the Bible makes clear that Jesus is God, and that the Holy Spirit is God. Furthermore, the Bible states that there is only one God. The Father, Son and Holy Spirit are three in one

No you don't understand, it's not just about the word missing. Scholars agree that the Trinitarian doctrine is "not taught explicitly" in the Bible. It is not "clear", as you say it. John 17 is a perfect example of a scripture that makes Trinitarianism far from "clear", with the Son praying to the Father that his disciples may become one with him (Jesus) as he (Jesus) is one with the father.

It isn't clear, it is subject to interpretation, and that is exactly what the Trinity doctrine is: an interpretation of isolated New testament passages by a group of bishops, hundreds of years after the contemporary followers of Christ (who never heard of the Trinity) had all died.

What is clear from scriptures is that Jesus is God. Holy Spirit is God. Father, Son and Holy Ghost are one. One God. They make up the Godhead.